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The Major's Thoughts
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  1. #1

    Default The Major's Thoughts

    Call me a nitpicking bastard, but I thought I'd ask a few questions and raise a few concerns about our new series. Don't get me wrong; I looooooooove the ANADAF. But I do want to know a few things.

    - What the hell IS the new Puck's name? Is it Zuzha Yu, or Zusha Yi?

    - If the Plodex constructs in #5 had no powers, as "Guardian" stated, then how was "Guardian" able to fire a blast at Walter and Nemesis, and fly? And how was "Shaman" able to summon up mystical winds to buffet Yukon Jack?

    - If Canada has no dollar bills per se, instead having "loonies" or whatever they're called, then how exactly would you pay a stripper? Throw coins at her? That just strikes me as odd, which is why the whole "singles" thing didn't bother me. It made sense to me, in fact.

    - Nemesis referred to Rutherford as Centennial in #5, but when did he actually pick a codename? After the scene with him and Nemesis in #4, I was under the impression that he didn't choose one yet. I would think that after that little scene, they'd make a somewhat big deal over him finally settling on a codename.

    - If Major Mapleleaf got cold right before "Snowbird's" attack on Yukon Jack, then why didn't he seem at all chilly riding Thunder in the Arctic skies?

  2. #2
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    If the Plodex constructs in #5 had no powers, as "Guardian" stated, then how was "Guardian" able to fire a blast at Walter and Nemesis, and fly? And how was "Shaman" able to summon up mystical winds to buffet Yukon Jack?
    You raise generally good questions about details that certainly opens you up to
    think some people need to stop dissecting it so thoroughly, and just enjoy it. I mean, come ON... Alpha Flight's a great team, and most of us here love them to pieces, but they're not all that marketable. Two cancelled series can attest to that. And I think Scott's approach to this series is a good one. It's fun, the characters are varied, and because most of the characters are new, people who have never read Alpha Flight before aren't bogged down with continuity.

    And frankly, people that b***h incessantly about the botching of Marrina's origin should shut up for two reasons. One, at least you got to SEE Marrina! And two, at least you've got Alpha Flight. Shut up and enjoy it
    The one fault I noticed with #5 but told myself I wouldn't bring up unless someone else did first!
    The Plodex using Mac, Heather and Shaman as templates for powered Plodex on Earth didn't work for me because the powers of those three are not inherent in their biologies. The Plodex are sufficiently advanced enough that they don't need to copy battlesuits made on Earth/ I don't think they would be able to copy Shaman's powers either.
    The only fix I can come up with in an invasion of the body snatchers type scenario, where they intentionally want disguise as known heroes. The powers displayed aren't specfifc to Shaman Mac and Heather, but general powers gene spliced in to maintain the illusion that these clones were those people.
    This would also explain why Sasquatch recruited unknowns rather than Northstar, Wyre, Talisman, etc. (Explain Nemesis as his knowledge that she is actually dead, so the Plodex would be unable to recreate her, or that she is not particularly known outside Department H.)

    Maybe Nemesis just named Centennial in the spot, ala Sue Storm naming Ben Grimm the Thing.

    I almost hate to admit it, but I've wondered about paying "exotic dancers" myself.
    www.kozzi.us

    recent publications in M-Brane Science Fiction and the anthology Things We Are Not.
    Forthcoming stories in Breath and Shadow, Star Dreck anthology and The Aether Age: Helios.

    ~I woke up one morning finally seeing the world through a rose colored lense. It turned out to be a blood hemorrhage in my good eye.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: The Major's Thoughts

    - If Canada has no dollar bills per se, instead having "loonies" or whatever they're called, then how exactly would you pay a stripper? Throw coins at her? That just strikes me as odd, which is why the whole "singles" thing didn't bother me. It made sense to me, in fact.
    I don't get the stripper reference and anyway, clients have just to pay 10$ and touch the lady, better than to throw 1 dollars coins

  4. #4
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    $1.00 bills can be strategically placed. Coins can't
    www.kozzi.us

    recent publications in M-Brane Science Fiction and the anthology Things We Are Not.
    Forthcoming stories in Breath and Shadow, Star Dreck anthology and The Aether Age: Helios.

    ~I woke up one morning finally seeing the world through a rose colored lense. It turned out to be a blood hemorrhage in my good eye.

  5. #5

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    And don't get me wrong, Kozzi... I LOVE the series. And I honestly don't give a crap about these faults. I was attempting to be sardonic with those questions, because there ARE a lot of people who too thoroughly dissect the comic and nitpick at it. And I decided to up the ante a little, LOL. Did I succeed?

  6. #6

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    Bloody inflation makes it so a reasonable tip is five bucks...

    Actually, I have no idea how things work in strip clubs...

    Thunder may have powers beyond flight, such as a heating system for passengers.

  7. #7
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    I don't see what ante there is to up.

    I've mentioned this to another poster who seems to have a tendency to attack posts that might be construed as negative: if everyone thinks the issue is good, there's not a lot of conversation on these boards about it.

    When Plodex were always green, both in Byrne's work, the Marvel Team-up annual and in much later work by Busiek during the Master's appearance in Kang War--every prior appearance by Plodex--they are suddenly now white-human colored. That's a major continuity flaw.
    Coloring them green would not alienate new readers.
    Pointing it out is also less nit-picky than spelling variations in Puck 2's name, or Marrina/Marinna mistakes or whether the members of the Flight are called Alpha (as Byrne did) or Alphans, the predominant title since Mantlo took over.

    I think most of the regulars on Ben's board understand that if someone takes the time to post their thoughts with specifics to the story rather than "this writer sucks because..." there's an inherent love of the title/characters driving the post.

    All of us want the Alpha title to do well. Continuity errors can alienate older readers, and if they're not pointed out, Scott can't avoid them the next time.

    I think discussion and criticism are good as long as it doesn't degrade to bashing of the creators. But people who post things like
    people that b***h incessantly...should shut up...and enjoy it
    should perhaps restrain their own nitpicking or appear hypocritical.
    There's no malice involved, and you should NOT avoid posting questions. Tendencies of telling people to shut up, however...
    www.kozzi.us

    recent publications in M-Brane Science Fiction and the anthology Things We Are Not.
    Forthcoming stories in Breath and Shadow, Star Dreck anthology and The Aether Age: Helios.

    ~I woke up one morning finally seeing the world through a rose colored lense. It turned out to be a blood hemorrhage in my good eye.

  8. #8

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    I wasn't appearing at all hypocritical. It's called sarcasm, with a splash of irony. So please, in the future, don't speak for me, 'k? Thanks.

    For as many long-time readers that might feel alienated by continuity errors and ironclad Alphans and the like, there are that many readers who are just happy to HAVE an Alpha Flight series with characters that they enjoy and find interesting and engaging. I'm pretty sure Marvel wouldn't bat an eyelid if Alpha Flight ended up cancelled. It's all about the Almighty X these days, in their estimation, anyway.

    Discussion is one thing. But when people start slamming every little detail that doesn't meet their lofty standards, THAT'S when they need to shut up and either enjoy it, or stop reading it. If you have a problem with continuity errors, fine. Discussions are wonderful. Debates are wonderful. But unnecessary and counterproductive *****ing is what needs to be eliminated.

    Some people need to remember that THIS ISN'T REAL. It's a comic book. If you've gotten to a point where you nitpick and dissect and don't truly enjoy what you're reading, then perhaps you shouldn't be reading comics.

    Just my two cents.

  9. #9
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    If logic and consistency are "lofty" standards, I am guilty. I think they're more realistic standards myself.
    http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=lofty

    Much of the marketing push by Marvel these days are with known properties: Alpha, another Black Panther coming up, She-Hulk, Iron Fist. These titles are starting over, and new readers will be drawn in with the new product. But such titles are also meant to attract the older readers, who are generally a lot less fickle than newbies into comics. Many newer readers will stray from title to title. People who have amassed large collections in the cupboards may get alienated by consistency errors, then they stop buying. Many new readers and/or speculators will automatically stop buying after the first issue or so. the new endeavors need to coax both for it to be a success. A good example is the most recent Inhumans series. It attracted new readers, but wasn't the "inhumans" older readers knew. Older readers didn't support the title. It is on the chopping block or may be already gone.

    Dissection is part of literature studies. Many colleges now have literature courses in science fiction, fantasy and even comics books, and the readership of those genres do tend to be a "nit-picky" bunch who are intelligent, educated, and have an eye for detail. Stan Lee knew this, thus the creation of the no-prize: WHY WASN'T OUR MISTAKE REALLY A MISTAKE? (Solution to the Plodex is that Walt humanized them in his narration so the new squad could relate to them.)

    Favorite stories tend to be read more than once, and that familiarity with the prior material often makes continuity mistakes glaringly obvious to older readers. I don't read any comic looking for mistakes, but where I have better knowledge through rereading, as is the case with Alpha Flight, the big boo-boos jump out at me.

    I wondered about strippers and singles during my first trip to the UK, where they use coins for anything under 5 Pounds--way to much to give an exotic dancer unless she's doing a lot more than dancing!

    The replication of characters with no innate powers also jumped out at me as a contradiction of general science fiction principles and internal consistency and logic.

    I never noticed the change in spelling with Puck 2, the use of Rutherford's code name or Mapleleaf's coldness.

    I am what YOU would consider nit-picky, and I never noticed three of five things you listed. This certainly indicates you reread AF #5 looking for nits to pick in a post. No matter what your intent, even if sarcasm or an attempt at irony, the act of reading it, looking for faults and posting them is HYPOCRITICAL.
    http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=hypocrisy

    Nowhere on this thread, or in ANY posts I remember, has anyone spoken for you. You were quoted directly and in context, and reiterated
    they need to shut up
    in bright red text.
    That's flaming or trolling, however you want to look at it, and those behaviours always indicate maturity issues.
    www.kozzi.us

    recent publications in M-Brane Science Fiction and the anthology Things We Are Not.
    Forthcoming stories in Breath and Shadow, Star Dreck anthology and The Aether Age: Helios.

    ~I woke up one morning finally seeing the world through a rose colored lense. It turned out to be a blood hemorrhage in my good eye.

  10. #10
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    first, gents, lets stay civil here eh? We can happily discuss criticisms about the book, about writers etc., but bashing and flaming is zero tolerance. That being said, this topic does not have that feel to it, so we'll not bring up past threads that may have.

    No, to the topic at hand.

    1. I think Yi was a misprint
    2. who knows with those crazy Plodex! They obviously are technologically advanced, and with guardian's mind in their hands, maybe they made a new suite.
    3. You can throw loonies and toonies on stage....so I hear....
    4. she probably just picked one, as he was having no luck
    5. Perhaps when he uses his powers to negate Thunder's gravity, they are somehow sheiled in the energy he uses to do so...

    Ben

  11. #11

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    On the question of Heather and Mac's suits. I'm thinking the plodex ship simply analyzed and copied the technology. Shaman and Snowbird's powers are bit more iffy, seeing how they are mystical in nature.

    My big question is about our new kid. Obviously he's Marrina's son, but is Namor his father?

  12. #12
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    yah, Birdy and Shaman are a little tougher to explai .

    The kid is is probably from when she had eggs befor she died. If I'm thinking back correctly, Namor basically "fathered" those eggs....However we haven't seen Marrina in a long time, so she could have found herself a new man, maybe a Plodex man...

    Ben

  13. #13

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    100,000 eggs... no wonder Marrina hasn't been seen in a while. She's probably taking a well-earned vacation! Girl's gotta be tired!

    Yes, yes, all your points are well-taken, but the fact remains that comic books are for enjoyment, not necessarily for intellectual or logical consumption. If you're THAT tied up in continuity errors, errors which can easily be overlooked because they are not the ESSENCE of a story (merely interchangable details), then perhaps comic books aren't the medium for you. But why read a comic if all you are going to do is pick it apart and find things that aren't necessarily correct? Doesn't that take some of the enjoyment out of reading them? I think it does.

    People have grown entirely too pseudo-intellectual about comics, and some of them take it to a rather obnoxious, self-possessed extreme. And frankly, I find that amusing when you think about the fact that they're almost entirely fictional, based on pseudoscience and outlandish premises.

    I did in no way flame or "troll", whatever that means, because I didn't direct my comment at any one person in particular. In fact, a significant reason that comics get cancelled is due to readers complaining about continuity errors. If they're really THAT bad, then don't read it. Constructive criticism is great and healthy discussions can lead to discoveries and realizations that one person might not have reached on their own, but when it degenerates to puerile nitpicking, then what's the point of reading it in the first place? I find that people who go looking for flaws tend to be rather negative anyway.

    When I told people to "shut up", perhaps I had just gotten fed up with reading dozens, if not hundreds, of e-mails and posts and comments from people finding things about the new Alpha Flight to ***** about. If it's so horrible, then don't read it. I, for one, would like to hear the GOOD things about a series, especially in its infancy, for a change. If you took that comment as flaming and trolling, then that's your call. But you did, in fact, speak for me ("tendencies of telling people to shut up" when there was in fact ONE POST that said as much comes to mind), and I don't appreciate it. If "telling people to shut up" indicates maturity issues, and I don't believe that they do in this instance, then surely posting links to dictionary definitions is spiteful and rude, and that's as much as indicator of maturity issues.

    I'm trying to defend a comic that I see as highly entertaining, amusing, interesting, thought-provoking, and engaging, and I grow tired of all the negativity. If there truly is no malice involved, then I stand corrected. But I perceived it nonetheless.

    By the by, I only read AF#5 once. I didn't NEED to re-read it looking for errors, because they were obvious, and I simply wanted to know if perhaps I had missed something. There's a difference between that, and nitpicking. So please, in the future, don't post dictionary definitions. I'm educated, thanks.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Major Mapleleaf Jr
    People have grown entirely too pseudo-intellectual about comics, and some of them take it to a rather obnoxious, self-possessed extreme. And frankly, I find that amusing when you think about the fact that they're almost entirely fictional, based on pseudoscience and outlandish premises.
    The premises may be outlandish, but we agree to play by the rules they set. If a character states that they don't have the Alphan powers, yet a few pages later they do, I'd have to call that a poor bit of writing.

    Still, I don't really look for that kind of thing. The Centennial codename thing totally went over my head for example.

    I don't think it's too much to ask of a writer to do his/her research or be consistant. Maybe we all have our "acceptable limit" for mistakes though.
    One of the first comics I started reading as a kid was Legion of Super-Heroes and I was blown away by how the writer(s) could keep track of so many characters and their individual histories.

    Also, I find people here come up with some clever explanations for the mistakes (reminiscent of the Marvel no-prize days) but we shouldn't have to do that. It's the writer's job to be clear.

    *I use he/she here because I'm not singling out Scott Lobdell. My opinion on the matter relates to all writers.

  15. #15
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    Default Re: The Major's Thoughts

    Quote Originally Posted by Major Mapleleaf Jr
    - If the Plodex constructs in #5 had no powers, as "Guardian" stated, then how was "Guardian" able to fire a blast at Walter and Nemesis, and fly? And how was "Shaman" able to summon up mystical winds to buffet Yukon Jack?
    Actually, if you read the page in question again, you will see that the answers are right there.

    Plodex Guardian doesnt say that they werent able to copy the originals' powers. What he said was: "We are Plodex. Even without the "powers" of our host bodies, we are notoriously difficult to kill."

    I think its just the phrasing of this statement that is misleading. I think it woud have been better put if he had sid: "Even if we didnt have the powers of our host bodies, we would still be notoriously difficult to kill."

    This is reinforced by Plodex Puck in the same page: "Once you are captured and placed in the transubstantiator, all your powers...etc etc... wil be available to us to create templates from your genetic structures. "

    Ergo, they do have the originals powers.

    Which will make next issue veeeery interesting if AF have to fight a whole army of fully powered AF.

    Notoriously difficult to kill is right. Even with the stab wound to her back and blood on her face, Plodex Heather still goes toe to toe with the Major...

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