Alpha Discussion at Fan Expo '13

[Flightpath07]

They marketed the heck out of Volume 4 though.

I was going to mention this, but held off as i did not want to play both sides of the field in this debate; too mentally exhausting.

[Jason Eberly]

A couple thoughts on the whole matter...

I wonder if mini-series have the same sales numbers standards as ongoings? As in, would a mini (not an event mini, though) that sold 25,000 be viewed as a success whereas an ongoing selling the same amount could easily be "on the chopping block".

I dislike the trend in Marvel these days that if a hero (or team) doesn't have their own title, they tend to get dumped on by every no-name villain that comes along. How about some Alpha appearances (as I consider the Canadian characters in the recent Avengers story as "Fodder Flight") were they actually come off as being helpful and maybe even contribute to saving the day without them being decimated? Some positive appearances might help garner some fan interest.

[Phil]

I wonder if mini-series have the same sales numbers standards as ongoings? As in, would a mini (not an event mini, though) that sold 25,000 be viewed as a success whereas an ongoing selling the same amount could easily be "on the chopping block".

The same standards, yes, but with a mini at least they know that any loss will be temporary as there is only a limited shelf life ie. while it's still not success at least the loss can't drop and drop and drop; there'll be an end and quickly.

[Le Messor]

How about some Alpha appearances (as I consider the Canadian characters in the recent Avengers story as "Fodder Flight") where they actually come off as being helpful and maybe even contribute to saving the day without them being decimated? Some positive appearances might help garner some fan interest.

That'd be cool. Another Uncanny #139, or something like that!

~ Le Messor
"Life is like a movie. Only you can't pick your genre."
~ Billy

[Jason Eberly]

That'd be cool. Another Uncanny #139, or something like that!

Exactly! You look at their appearances prior to getting their own series, and they were either formidable opponents (Uncanny #120-121, Sasquatch in Hulk Annual #8, etc.) or competent allies (Uncanny #139-140, Machine Man # <whatever issues those were>, Hulk #272, Marvel Team-Up Annual #7 (Okay, I know that last one came out after the AF series started, but not by too long).

Unfortunately, as AF went along in their own series, creators seemed to turn the concept of Byrne's dysfunctional family into AF being a bunch of incompetent, easily manipulated buffoonish cannon fodder (Seagle, Lobdell, Bendis, Hickman). FVL and Pak seemed to be on a better track of rehabilitating their image a bit, but I think it was too early for AF to get their own series again. They need some positive PR across the MU for awhile first, some good buzz.

Maybe then...

[Le Messor]

Yep - but I definitely prefer them as competent allies, so they're set up as good guys first. (Though, opponent to the Hulk - that can still be a good guy!)

It was Machine Man #18 (which I recently reviewed on this site somewhere).

~ Le Messor
"Lockwood's Long Shot: The chances of getting eaten up by a lion on Main Street aren't one in a million, but once would be enough."

[Legerd]

Exactly! You look at their appearances prior to getting their own series, and they were either formidable opponents (Uncanny #120-121, Sasquatch in Hulk Annual #8, etc.) or competent allies (Uncanny #139-140, Machine Man # <whatever issues those were>, Hulk #272, Marvel Team-Up Annual #7 (Okay, I know that last one came out after the AF series started, but not by too long).

Unfortunately, as AF went along in their own series, creators seemed to turn the concept of Byrne's dysfunctional family into AF being a bunch of incompetent, easily manipulated buffoonish cannon fodder (Seagle, Lobdell, Bendis, Hickman). FVL and Pak seemed to be on a better track of rehabilitating their image a bit, but I think it was too early for AF to get their own series again. They need some positive PR across the MU for awhile first, some good buzz.

Maybe then...

This is what I've been saying. Marvel writers have spent 20+ years turning AF into jokes, so despite all the good work done on volume 4--the writing, artwork, interviews, advertising--it was a steep uphill climb for the title which ultimately failed. Most of the fans reading nowadays probably weren't even born when Byrne wrote AF, and would more than likely only be aware of the team as the incompetent losers depicted for the last 2-3 decades. It will take time and guest appearances as a powerful, competent team before fans will accept them, and then Marvel might have some success with a volume 5.

[Flightpath07]

This is what I've been saying. Marvel writers have spent 20+ years turning AF into jokes, so despite all the good work done on volume 4--the writing, artwork, interviews, advertising--it was a steep uphill climb for the title which ultimately failed. Most of the fans reading nowadays probably weren't even born when Byrne wrote AF, and would more than likely only be aware of the team as the incompetent losers depicted for the last 2-3 decades. It will take time and guest appearances as a powerful, competent team before fans will accept them, and then Marvel might have some success with a volume 5.

Legerd, there's a flip point to that, unfortunately. That is a lot of work for Marvel to do, for a team that does not currently have its own series, all in the hopes of one day getting the team its own title. Especially after how many times Alpha has already failed.

Dang, i'm turning into Phil! lol. (love ya, Phil!)

[Phil]

It's also not unique to AF though; Winter Guard, MI-5, New Warriors etc. are all in a similar boat.

[Le Messor]

Winter Guard, MI-5, New Warriors etc. are all in a similar boat.

We call it the Titanic.

[Flightpath07]

We call it the Titanic.

*looks around for Celine Dion, with a shudder rolling up and down his spine*

[Legerd]

Legerd, there's a flip point to that, unfortunately. That is a lot of work for Marvel to do, for a team that does not currently have its own series, all in the hopes of one day getting the team its own title. Especially after how many times Alpha has already failed.

Dang, I'm turning into Phil! lol. (love ya, Phil!)

I quite agree, it will be a lot of work, but whose fault is that? I never said it would be easy, but Marvel needs to broaden their line of comics, because fans are starting to notice how thin it's become. Even DC has figured out they need to bring in more non-American characters/teams, the question is will they do a decent job of it, or muck it up?

[Le Messor]

Muck it up.

[Flightpath07]

That's one vote for Mucking, no votes for Good. I'm voting Undecided (but only because I cannot vote Independent).

[Le Messor]

Ooh, please don't remind me. We've just had our election.