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Thread: MMLJ Powers/Punch Bag etc etc...

  1. #1

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    Quote Originally Posted by Phil
    Thunder had the power, MMLJ was definitely powerless.
    Yep, he is powerless but he took a Plodex Vindicator's II punch without even moving.

  2. #2

  3. #3

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    Quote Originally Posted by Phil
    Emphasis on Plodex.
    The Plodex clones had all the power and memories of the original hosts

  4. #4

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    Well considering even a punch from my 9 year old would move me a little bit, this is still fairly impressive! Put any kind of mass behind that punch (say a full grown Plodex Vindicator) and it should still hurt a normal man. So, obviously he's super-human.

  5. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by Barnacle13
    Well considering even a punch from my 9 year old would move me a little bit, this is still fairly impressive! Put any kind of mass behind that punch (say a full grown Plodex Vindicator) and it should still hurt a normal man. So, obviously he's super-human.
    That's the only super-human display of power yet, but the handbooks say he is peak human in every area.

  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by King Mungi
    Quote Originally Posted by Phil
    Emphasis on Plodex.
    The Plodex clones had all the power and memories of the original hosts
    Power and memories yes.
    Skills, experiences and techniques I doubt.
    In the MU the original always has an edge over a clone.

    And taking a punch doesn't mean he had a power, or that he didn't feel pain.
    I could take several rounds of punches from a mugger before passing out or whatever, it doesn't give me super powers.

  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by Phil
    Power and memories yes.
    Skills, experiences and techniques I doubt.
    In the MU the original always has an edge over a clone.

    And taking a punch doesn't mean he had a power, or that he didn't feel pain.
    I could take several rounds of punches from a mugger before passing out or whatever, it doesn't give me super powers.
    Memories goes hand in hand with experience, technique and skills. You wouldn't have any of that without memories.

    He didn't feel pain, he was smiling.

    Without even budging? especially from a character that can lift multiple tons (25-75 ton range)? doubtful.

  8. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by King Mungi
    Memories goes hand in hand with experience, technique and skills.
    Not true, possessing memories and knowing how to utilise them are two entirely different scientific things.

    You wouldn't have any of that without memories.
    Again, not true. You just need to look at amnesiacs to see that some things are almost programmed, even without memory.
    And even if it were true, having memories doesn't automatically equate having the physical skills. Hence my first point.

    He didn't feel pain, he was smiling.
    People deal with pain in different ways.
    He was trying to fit in to a new group of people, to show off to Zusha, to be like his father, to prove his worth etc.. He could quite easily be masking his pain.
    Or his pain receptors/nerves could be disfunctional or miswired.
    Or he could simply 'get off' on pain.

    Without even budging? especially from a character that can lift multiple tons (25-75 ton range)? doubtful.
    Have we ever seen Plodex Vindicator II lift that much?
    What if the clone wasn't actually as powerful as the original?

    And lifting doesn't equate to the power of punching at all.
    I'm positive there are champion weight lifters who couldn't throw a punch to save their lives.

    It may seem like I'm over analysing this, but you really do seem to be grasping at straws to try and find MMLJ a power, even though it's been clearly communicated, and now stated on paper, in print, as canon, that he has none.

  9. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by Phil
    Not true, possessing memories and knowing how to utilise them are two entirely different scientific things.
    You do realize your talking about the Plodex, who's entrie purpse is to stay alive and absorb entire civilizations and take on their characteristics. I highly doubt Plodex wouldn;t know how to use it's memories. It was also said they copied their abilities not just power and memories

    You wouldn't have any of that without memories.
    Again, not true. You just need to look at amnesiacs to see that some things are almost programmed, even without memory.
    And even if it were true, having memories doesn't automatically equate having the physical skills. Hence my first point.
    Like what? normal human beings without even guidance have certain aspects programmed into their brain their suppose to do. Show me an amnesiac person fighting with skill without his memories. He would have no idea what a judo toss is even if he knew it before hand,

    People deal with pain in different ways.
    He was trying to fit in to a new group of people, to show off to Zusha, to be like his father, to prove his worth etc.. He could quite easily be masking his pain.
    Or his pain receptors/nerves could be disfunctional or miswired.
    Or he could simply 'get off' on pain.
    Wow, come on dude. You also have to take into account even force. A full punch from Plodex Vindicator didn't even BUDGE HIM. Masking pain, which I doubt even was the case was one thing, but not moving at all...impressive feat.

    Have we ever seen Plodex Vindicator II lift that much?
    What if the clone wasn't actually as powerful as the original?

    And lifting doesn't equate to the power of punching at all.
    I'm positive there are champion weight lifters who couldn't throw a punch to save their lives.

    It may seem like I'm over analysing this, but you really do seem to be grasping at straws to try and find MMLJ a power, even though it's been clearly communicated, and now stated on paper, in print, as canon, that he has none.
    They did, "ALL your powers, your abilities, your memories".

    So that's like an average joe taking a punch from Sasquatch and not budging. Come on man, I'm all for MMJr. just being peak human, but honestly if a multiple ton character punched you, you actual believe you wouldn't even move? Spider-Man even holding back has sent "normal" people flying with a mere flick of his finger.

    What? No I said he was powerless, why do I care if he has powers? I even stated that several times. Even on paper they state Sasquatch is class 70 and look at this feats, even look at Guardian;s entry it doesn't describe his power accuratetly. Do I think MM jr. has powers? no.

  10. #10

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    Ooooh Canon! Please, we all know that Marvel's canon has less firepower than a bottle rocket.

    I think that horse whispering is a power lol!

    I also don't think I'm grasping at straws (you are over analyzing it though!) as someone has to be wearing the suit and I can easily see it being MM if there was a twist to be had. The vindicator hit is a VERY strong indicator of invunerability, and its far more likely that he was able to take that hit by himself due to powers or bad writing as opposed to your "getting off on pain" explanation. He also takes and dishes several hits during the wax fight that would point to him having invunerability.

    One power he definately has is: PURE UNADULTERATED GOODNESS!!

    god i'm tired.

  11. #11

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    Look. Vindicator's powers originally the product of a suit, yes?

    And in MAc's case, later became the result of cybernetics.

    Neither of which would be duplicated bya clone. A clone is generated from pure biological tissue. So maybe the Plodex Vindicator had a crappy suit with no strength enhancement. Seems simple enough to me.
    "You cannot win, mailman Mike. If you strike me down, I shall become more powerful than you can possibly imagine."

  12. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by Transmetropolitan
    Look. Vindicator's powers originally the product of a suit, yes?

    And in MAc's case, later became the result of cybernetics.

    Neither of which would be duplicated bya clone. A clone is generated from pure biological tissue. So maybe the Plodex Vindicator had a crappy suit with no strength enhancement. Seems simple enough to me.
    Mac's cybernetics became ignored as evident in the X-Men vs. Alpha Flight battle where Northstar ripped off the suit and left James powerless.

    Also if that were the case, than how did the Plodex copy magic? Such as Shaman still was able to do magical spells and it's not due to genetics. He relys on his pouch, did they copy that as well? Also the Plodex are very advanced, I wouldn't put it pass them to even copy the suit as they already have it in captivity a long with the rest of Alpha Flight.

  13. #13

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    Maybe they didn't actually copy magic. Maybe they came up with biological approximations instead. Makes more sense than any other explanation.
    "You cannot win, mailman Mike. If you strike me down, I shall become more powerful than you can possibly imagine."

  14. #14

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    I think what makes the most sense is actually just what appeared to happen: "We took all of their powers, nuff said."

  15. #15

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    Except that they clearly didn't. MMLJr has no powers. Stated fact. Therefore, had they actually copied AF's powers perfectly, Sadler should've been little more than a greasy smudge on Clone Vindicator's knuckles.
    "You cannot win, mailman Mike. If you strike me down, I shall become more powerful than you can possibly imagine."

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