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Volume 2
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Thread: Volume 2

  1. #1

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    You know, perhaps the v2 Alpha Flight wasn't the Alpha Flight that everyone knew... but how many rosters stay the same throughout the years? Look at the X-Men. You don't get the original five plus Xavier in one title. There are loads of characters that weren't there before, but characters that people have grown to love. Bishop. Psylocke. Emma Frost. And the list can go on and on.

    My point is, the X-Men have changed over the years, and the message of change/evolution is the crux of most Marvel comics. It always has been. And I just don't think people gave the new Alpha Flight enough of a chance. So Murmur was an Aurora/Persuasion knock-off... so what? So Radius was a Northstar knock-off... so what?

    In both cases, I don't see either of them as direct knock-offs, anyway. Murmur and Kara had completely different ways of using their powers, and completely different personalities. So Aurora and Murmur were both French-Canadian and the "vixens" of their teams. Aurora was never a sexpot to be malicious, or mysterious... but Murmur was. And in the Radius/Northstar case, they were both moody and argumentative... but Northstar was that way (arguably) because of his past as both a mutant and a terrorist AND a homosexual, a past that led him to feel quite alone. Radius was LITERALLY cut off from the world, and Radius was a lot meaner than Northstar. Northstar was just a *****. Radius was mean. Big difference.

    I loved v2. I always will. And I loved all the characters... all of them, even Manbot. And do you know why? Because Alpha Flight was back. It wasn't the same Alpha Flight... and thank God. If I wanted the same Alpha Flight, exactly the way it used to be, why go through the expense of collecting a new series when I can just read back issues? If the characters and plots in the back issues are what I want out of Alpha Flight, then why would I want a new series when I can read one done correctly? Because life is change. And during the whole Heroes Reborn thing, Alpha Flight had to stand out from all the other titles doing the superhero thing, otherwise it was bound to get lost in the shuffle. It's harder to snag new readers on the superhero-formula when you've got heavy hitters like the Fantastic Four and the Avengers and the X-Men doing the same thing... names people recognize a LOT more readily than Alpha Flight. So they went the government conspiracy route. Why? Because it's already been touched on in the past in regards to Alpha Flight, and because OBVIOUSLY there was a market for it, because people read the book, and people watched X-Files.

    And on another note, I also think that AFv2 and X-Files can only be loosely compared. Alpha Flight wasn't investigating paranormal activities blindly. Alpha Flight was being actively and harmfully manipulated for no other reason than government power plays... because Department H COULD do it. It was cool to see all the mysteries that Seagle set up, and I think it's a shame that dismal sales forced Seagle to try to bail out the book by throwing in the veterans. It was shameless and tacky, because the book didn't need the old timers. It was doing quite well, from a character standpoint, on its own.

    I guarantee that if v2 had been allowed to run longer, and we had gotten more character development than was possible with ten primary characters and loads of recurring/background characters in the span of twenty issues, people might not yap their traps so much about how Radius and Murmur suck, because we would've gotten some character development out of them.

    You don't like v2? Fine. You don't like continuity errors? Also fine. But if you're going to be unfair and negative, perhaps the Alpha Flight message boards isn't the place to be that way. We're all fans here (I think), and while criticism is healthy and allows for discussion, it's quite another to put down someone else's work... especially when you don't know enough about what was going on in the writer's head to be able to pass a fair judgment. If you come into a series with preconceived notions (and let's face it, anyone who read the title "All-New, All-Different Alpha Flight" and still thought that the book was going to focus on the original members is a bit silly) about how things should be, then perhaps you should submit a proposal to Marvel and write the damn thing yourself.

    This rant is over.

  2. #2
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    Heh, wrong thread? :P

    As I stated, I too really enjoyed Vol.2, but for me I've probably enjoyed these frirst 3 issues of Vol.3 more than than the whole of Vol.2 put together because it has more of the elements of Vol.1 in it.

    I still consider Vol.2 Alpha Flight, and it's definitely considered canon.

    To me however, Vol.2 was to Vol.1 as X-Force was to New Mutants, if you get me?
    Whereas Vol.3 to Vol.2 is as New Mutants Vol.2 is to X-Force.

    *koff*insertCableanalogyhere*koff*

  3. #3

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    Using Cable to get your point across is REALLY low, Phil.

  4. #4
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    Okay, before we get to far into this and it gets to far out of hand, maybe some clarification is required. I would aslso like to point out tha I make a case of using IMO or IMHO to reiforce the fact that I am expresing a personal opinion, not stating established facts.

    In regards to Roster change, I'm all for it, but all the characters who came into AF during vol 1 had some established history with the team and character developement occured, so I have no problem with new characters. In regards to Radius and Murmur, I refer to them as knock=ofs in the sense that the characteristics they showed were similar to Northstar and Aurora. By the very nature of what Seagle was trying to present, character developement had to be sacrificed for plot developement. Scott Lobdell has developed the new characters more in three issues than Seagle did in twenty, the time that vol 2 came out, I don't think that readers were willing to wait for character developement, so while established fans stayed and collected, lots of new fans left the book. Result being cancellation.

    I'm glad that people enjoyed vol 2, but it just wasn't for me and in regards to putting down peoples work, I can only speak as I find. I didn't like Seagles work, but I don't belief I slandered his character in expressing that view point.

    I also don't see where I have been unfair, this is a discussion forum where views are expressed, wouldn't be much to discuss if we all agreed on everything. I have given my opinion, if that opinion is negative then unfortunately that is not somthing I can help.

    Everyone I have met on this forum has been a worthwhile addtion to the forum, viewpoints will differ, but at the end of the day it's a comic, and a comic shouldn't cause ill will on such a friendly forum as this.

    So while my opinion will not change, I hope that no one gets offended when I express it.
    Del

    Driftwood: Well, I got about a foot and a half. Now, it says, uh, "The party of the second part shall be known in this contract as the party of the second part."
    Fiorello: Well, I don't know about that...
    Driftwood: Now what's the matter?
    Fiorello: I no like-a the second party, either.
    Driftwood: Well, you should've come to the first party. We didn't get home 'til around four in the morning... I was blind for three days!

  5. #5

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    None of that was directed at you, Del. None of it. And don't think for a second that I don't respect your opinion as well. Definitely not the case! I just felt the need to get those feelings out, and let people know where I stand... and I know I was a tad intolerant about it, and for that I apologize. I just enjoyed v2 very much, and I am defending the series and characters that I loved as any person would, you know?

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Major Mapleleaf Jr
    None of that was directed at you, Del. None of it. And don't think for a second that I don't respect your opinion as well. Definitely not the case! I just felt the need to get those feelings out, and let people know where I stand... and I know I was a tad intolerant about it, and for that I apologize. I just enjoyed v2 very much, and I am defending the series and characters that I loved as any person would, you know?
    MMjr, no problem, and I applaud you for your vociferous support of AF vol 2, it's that level of support for the team, no matter what the incarnation that IMO sets AF fans apart from others and long may it continue. That said, I guess vol 2 is going to be a bone of contention anywhere Af is discussed, but I shall continue to respect any view point even if I am in direct opposition to it.

    Take Care
    Del

    Driftwood: Well, I got about a foot and a half. Now, it says, uh, "The party of the second part shall be known in this contract as the party of the second part."
    Fiorello: Well, I don't know about that...
    Driftwood: Now what's the matter?
    Fiorello: I no like-a the second party, either.
    Driftwood: Well, you should've come to the first party. We didn't get home 'til around four in the morning... I was blind for three days!

  7. #7
    Alpha Flight

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    I thought it was sad when fake Sasquatch (or should that be REAL Sasquatch) died saving Radius. I thought it was a shame he was never reunited with his family in the wilds where he belonged.

    I even thought Manbot was okay actually - I would have liked an issue devoted to his origin as I think it would have proved interesting.

    I did enjoy vol.2 in some ways and in others I didn't - but I have to say that the same can be said of the original run of the series. The series had so many different writers and directions that volume 2 can just be seen as an extention of that really.

    Oh and btw, X-Force... *shudder*

  8. #8
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    I liked Volume 2, granted I was out of comics at the time when it was actually being published, so i got the series as a whole and read it straight through. I liked the new characters and the conspircay theories and the entire mood of the book, what i hated 90% of the time was the art, the original artist was ok, but I did not think that Duncan Realeu(sp) fit the tone of the book, and i think his art hurt an already suffering book.

    What frustrates me is the book was cancelled without Seagle getting to tell all his story and then we have Joe Casey go and attempt to kill Radius for no other reason then to have someone die. I say attempt cause i think he is still alive, least i hope
    "Adjust is bland evil"

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