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What If...? - Page 3
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  1. #31
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    Let's face it, comics are a mess lately!

  2. #32
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    100% agree. Even DC is a terrible mess since convergence

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by -K-M- View Post
    oh and on an earlier point, Mac has only technically died once and that was in the Collective fight (not including his clone)
    To me, any death counts if the reader is expected to believe it. Especially if the writer meant it at the time!
    I think the same about Jean.

    Quote Originally Posted by Phil View Post
    Let's face it, comics are a mess lately!
    Since how long? It's an interesting question, I think:
    For me, it's since the '90s; others would probably say more recently. Others might say we're on the upswing. Others say since the '80s.

    That said, there are still things out there that are good.

    ~ Le Messor
    "My 90s-era comic collection won't burn itself!"
    ~ Teenomicon, Welcome To Showside #1

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by -K-M- View Post
    100% agree. Even DC is a terrible mess since convergence
    This breaks my heart so much. Because I was never a big DC fan. Used to hate Superman and Batman comics, because it seemed like every story, they were just impossible to beat, to the point that it was ridiculous. Even Captain America gets his @$$ handed to him - quite frequently. Granted, Superman "died" (gimmick) and Batman eventually got his back broken.

    But New 52 was where I set all of my preconceived notions aside, and said, "I am going to give every book a try!" And I literally collected just about every New 52 - even if it was full of characters I never heard of (Justice League International, for example; Katana, Vibe, etc). And I really, really liked the New 52. It felt like "classic" super hero comics to me. Good guys fighting bad guys. No over the top drama and dialogue bubbles covering everything (I love dialogue, but a lot of writers go WAY overboard and forget they're telling a story in a comic, not a novel).

    Then Convergence happened. And my collecting dropped in DC to barely anything. Marvel, even less.

    Quote Originally Posted by Le Messor View Post
    To me, any death counts if the reader is expected to believe it. Especially if the writer meant it at the time!
    I think the same about Jean.
    Agreed; because the writer planned that character's death. Some other writer then come along and say, "He teleported away at the right time, and has just been missing for 10 years" or "It was actually a clone by Government Agency X!"

    Quote Originally Posted by Le Messor View Post
    Since how long? It's an interesting question, I think:
    For me, it's since the '90s; others would probably say more recently. Others might say we're on the upswing. Others say since the '80s.
    That said, there are still things out there that are good.
    For me it was definitely the 90's. While it had some great comics out there - that I think are absolutely ground breaking in terms of story telling (New Warriors under Fabian) - the 90's was also the time that it felt like comics shifted from being about the story to being about the art. And we saw a rise in folks like Marc Silvestri (whose art I absolutely love), Rob Liefeld, Todd McFarlane, Jim Lee (and basically everyone who would eventually go on to make IMAGE which also boomed in the 90's - and cemented the "art over the story" vibe). Because I love me some WildCATS and CyberForce - but re-reading those, you can tell the story telling is very weak, but the art was fantastic. And with IMAGE's rise in popularity back then, I think the Big Two shifted that way. Avengers and X-Men, both staple books for me, back then, became very blah.

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Legerd View Post
    What if Scramble (Lionel Jefferies) had defeated Alpha Flight, and amalgamated them into his Omega form like he did Roger Bochs?
    That would be one very powerful - and undoubtedly - insane! - piece of blobby flesh!

  6. #36
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    What If?! Alpha Flight teamed up with Justice League?! Which version of AF would you want to team up with JL?
    “God made only one of each of us. It's up to us to make the most of our individuality.” Kevin Max

  7. #37
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    Justice League!
    Good one, eh?

    OTOH, 'which version'? There's only ever one answer with me - Byrne's version.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mekko Hotvle View Post
    What If?! Alpha Flight teamed up with Justice League?! Which version of AF would you want to team up with JL?
    Especially since they (sort of) had a Justice League Canada.

  9. #39
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    Never did get to read that JLC/Justice League United which I had to search to see who was part of the JLC. Adam Strange, Supergirl, Hawkman, Green Arrow, Stargirl, Martian Manhunter and Animal Man, and the young Canadian Miiyahbin. Did anyone read this?
    “God made only one of each of us. It's up to us to make the most of our individuality.” Kevin Max

  10. #40
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    Stargirl vs Aurora! How would this play out?
    “God made only one of each of us. It's up to us to make the most of our individuality.” Kevin Max

  11. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mekko Hotvle View Post
    Never did get to read that JLC/Justice League United which I had to search to see who was part of the JLC. Adam Strange, Supergirl, Hawkman, Green Arrow, Stargirl, Martian Manhunter and Animal Man, and the young Canadian Miiyahbin. Did anyone read this?
    I did. I had high hopes - it had Supergirl, Hawkman, Green Arrow who I am already fans of - and then I became a fan of Stargirl for her appearance throughout the New 52.

    But the title did not feel like it had any pacing. It felt like it was everywhere. And I can't even stand Animal Man... Literally made the story almost unbearable every time he showed up... He's this "animal man" but came across as nothing more than an annoyance... I wasn't buying his "feral" nature.

  12. #42
    Semper ubi sub ubi Alpha Flight
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mekko Hotvle View Post
    Never did get to read that JLC/Justice League United which I had to search to see who was part of the JLC. Adam Strange, Supergirl, Hawkman, Green Arrow, Stargirl, Martian Manhunter and Animal Man, and the young Canadian Miiyahbin. Did anyone read this?
    I picked it up for a bit, because I wanted to see what they would do with the new character, Equinox. Sadly, the story kept stringing me along for months without her doing anything, being in costume, or even meeting the other heroes.

    You are a stupid seal with a small rooster. Translate that into french and you'll get it.

  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Legerd View Post
    I picked it up for a bit, because I wanted to see what they would do with the new character, Equinox. Sadly, the story kept stringing me along for months without her doing anything, being in costume, or even meeting the other heroes.
    Sounds like a case of decompressed story-telling combined with the need for the Mystery.

    What if John Byrne hadn't quit the book?

  14. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Le Messor View Post
    What if John Byrne hadn't quit the book?
    Sasquatch would not have died.
    Snowbird would not have died.
    Puck would not have a spirit in him.
    Alpha Flight wouldn't have been replaced by a "B" Squad.

    The downside, there would have been no Goblyn - who I actually liked (her and Laura). Though not enough to have replaced the rest of Alpha Flight.

    I truly think that if he had remained on the book - though he claimed he didn't enjoy it - that the book would have done exceptionally well.

  15. #45
    The Eclectic Opinionator Alpha Flight
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    Default Alpha Flight, Equinox, & "psychic deaths"

    Quote Originally Posted by Phil View Post
    Isn't Aurora the only member from the original + #1 line-up to not have died?

    ...
    Aurora/Jeanne-Marie, Northstar/Jean-Paul, and Talisman/Elizabeth suffered "psychic death" by Somon in AF (vol. 1) # 24; Walter helped save them all.

    Quote Originally Posted by Legerd View Post
    I picked it up for a bit, because I wanted to see what they would do with the new character, Equinox. Sadly, the story kept stringing me along for months without her doing anything, being in costume, or even meeting the other heroes.
    I didn't know there was another character named "Equinox" other than the Marvel one. It's too bad that nobody is really doing anything with characters...new or old...that I have a real interest in. Got any pictures of the DC character you can post?

    Quote Originally Posted by Le Messor View Post
    Sounds like a case of decompressed story-telling combined with the need for the Mystery.

    What if John Byrne hadn't quit the book?

    I find Alpha Flight volume 1 #s 1 through 28 to be more memorable than a lot of the other, more celebrated work. What constitutes "drama" in a comic-book is something I still wonder about to this day: a lot of the vulnerability of the original character's definitely lends itself to life-or-death drama. What seems to separate what is believable and what isn't believable is the amount of effort put into the plausibility of the characterizations, motivations, and plot: some creators put some thought and effort into the plausibility, some did not.
    The Mostly-New, Mostly-Different AF1

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