New Avengers 16 (no spoilers, but a link to some)

Also, it looks like 2 members of the original FF are slated for termination.
Just curious to know where you got this from. I've read the same thing (just to show that I'm not trying to question you), but I can't remember where, I know I've read it from two different sources. I think (hope) that one of those two deaths will be of an actual FF member (I think one report I read said it was Sue that bites the bullet, but perhaps I'm wrong) and that the second will be an old "temporary replacement" hero of the FF (Medusa, She-Hulk, etc.) If it goes two of the actual FF, I'm thinking the Storms will take the plunge.

The stuff about Alpha Flight being expendable to to their Canadian-ism makes me sad....
Yes, sadly that has gotten way out of hand. After I learned about the Flight's demise the other day and was feeling down while waiting for class, my friend asked what the problem was and I said that it was the death of the Canadian superhero team, and she laughed, not because I was upset at the 'death' of fictional characters, but rather at the Canadian element. I've gotten this alot over the past few years of Alpha Flight collection, but occasionally I actually persuade the doubters to read an issue or two and after even just a short exposure they come out with a lot more respect for the team, although I'm not sure that affects their grander view on the national scale.

I had read some time ago somewhere that the Collective was the transferred energy of the depowered mutants, as energy cannot be created or destroyed.

My thought was that if the Collective character absorbs power, as he did of the depowered mutants, he may not be limited to mutants in his current form. His defeat of AF could have been absorption of their powers, and they can be restored when the Collective is defeated. Yes, their are loopholes, such as Walter being unconscious/dead in his Sasquatch form, but I'm still convinced of the workability of the general theory that there's this already-existing reset for the House of M story, and it can easily be applied to AF's "death."

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Originally Posted by Shaman Of The Whills

The stuff about Alpha Flight being expendable to to their Canadian-ism makes me sad....
Yes, sadly that has gotten way out of hand. After I learned about the Flight's demise the other day and was feeling down while waiting for class, my friend asked what the problem was and I said that it was the death of the Canadian superhero team, and she laughed, not because I was upset at the 'death' of fictional characters, but rather at the Canadian element. I've gotten this alot over the past few years of Alpha Flight collection, but occasionally I actually persuade the doubters to read an issue or two and after even just a short exposure they come out with a lot more respect for the team, although I'm not sure that affects their grander view on the national scale.

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Yeah, generally people focus on and attack the perceived faults of their neighbours when their bad conscience keeps reminding them of their own glaring faults.

So Canada marches to the beat of it's own drum. I believe that is how the good ol' US of A was founded.

In any event political boundaries are such a stupid reason to divide ourselves ... knowing what we all know about politics. We share the same language, more-or-less the same culture, and when we meet up face-to-face we learn the obvious.

Anyway, as "Canada" is not necessarily a huge part of what I consider my identity to be, who cares. Canadian politics tend to suck as much as any other.

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Originally Posted by Shaman Of The Whills

Also, it looks like 2 members of the original FF are slated for termination.
Just curious to know where you got this from. I've read the same thing (just to show that I'm not trying to question you), but I can't remember where, I know I've read it from two different sources.

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I think I came across it by following one of the links off a forum post about the 'fall' of AF. It could've been from a "Monday with Marts" page. I do recall in that same article/interview that Sue Storm was slated for 'termination' in that storyline.

I haven't read a Marvel comic since Joss Whedon's X-Men #10 or so - about a year ago? It looks like things have changed a lot in the Marvel Universe since then.

By the way, have all Marvel comics gone to direct market? I can't find any of them in the newsagents these days.

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Originally Posted by sengsterooney

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Originally Posted by Shaman Of The Whills

Also, it looks like 2 members of the original FF are slated for termination.
Just curious to know where you got this from. I've read the same thing (just to show that I'm not trying to question you), but I can't remember where, I know I've read it from two different sources.

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I think I came across it by following one of the links off a forum post about the 'fall' of AF. It could've been from a "Monday with Marts" page. I do recall in that same article/interview that Sue Storm was slated for 'termination' in that storyline.

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I think it was the last Joe Fridays over at newsarama.

Read the thread on Newsarama.....i can't believe some of the fans.

The Alpha got whipped in New Avengers to bring publicity to the team.
It's got people talking about the "death".
In June we could be getting a new Alpha Flight title with Northstar and co.

I think Marvel are going to put effort into a AF title this time after the massive failure of Vol. 3.

Will see how it goes.

This may be steering the topic away from the main conversation a bit--and I'm sorry if this has been brought up before--but, looking at the shot of the team beside their jet it almost seemed to me as if it was drawn to reflect the legendary Avro Arrow.

If anyone else sees this let me know because I think it kind of adds a dimension of coolness to the issue (even if that's almost impossible); if the artists did that kind of research to pay homage to a relatively obsure bit of Canadian history.

New Avengers #17
"Our Avengers have been mighty! Our Avengers have been assembled– and disassembled! Our Avengers have been new! Now, the newest artist to take up the pencil and assemble Earth’s mightiest, Mike Deodato, in an arc that sees their recent past come back to haunt them!

Joining the ranks of wordsmith Brian Michael Bendis, fan-favorite Mike Deodato comes aboard to give life to The Collective, and possible death to some of our heroes! Born of the energy released at the end of House of M., this new threat is the greatest one the new team has ever faced, and they will need all of their members if they stand a chance of defeating it! New Avengers (and creators) ASSEMBLE!"

I wonder if they are going to explain Alpha Flight.

Over at uncannyxmen.net , the astute reviewer for New Avengers #16 points out:

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This marks the first appearance of Alpha Flight since Alpha Flight (3rd series): The All-New, All-Different Alpha Flight #12. However, that issue left such a mess, and Alpha Flight barely say anything this issue, so it is hard to tell what, if anything, has been cleared up from the third series. At the end of Alpha Flight (3rd series): The All-New, All-Different Alpha Flight #12, we had Guardian, Heather, Snowbird, Shaman, Puck and Earthmover in space. On Earth, there was Sasquatch and his team of Alphans - Nemesis III, Major Mapleleaf II, Puck II, Yukon Jack and Centennial. In addition, the past versions of Guardian, Heather, Snowbird, Shaman, Northstar, Aurora and Puck from circa Alpha Flight (1st series) #12 were brought to the present. The question begs, which Alpha Flight is depicted here? It is hard to tell. Obviously there is only on [sic] Sasquatch, Major Mapleleaf and Puck II. Centennial and Nemesis III are apparently dead, and Yukon Jack and the past Snowbird were married and moved to his kingdom. The team here can possibly be the past Guardian, Heather, Shaman and Puck, which brings up the question of where the past Northstar and Aurora are, and offers up a rather large continuity problem, as the past Heather circa Alpha Flight (1st series) #12 was not a costumed hero. While Heather is a smart woman, the past Heather could have quickly learned how to use a battle suit, but Heather circa Alpha Flight (2nd series) #1, found the geothermal battle suit, which she is wearing here, much more difficult to use then her previous electromagnetic one. If this is the case, it would mean that the real Guardian, Heather, Snowbird, Puck, Shaman and Earthmover are still in space.

It seems odd the Puck (Judd) would as he puts it ‘I’ll do the talking’ considering Guardian, Heather and Sasquatch have all lead Alpha Flight, he has not.

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This hints at what might be the irrelevancy of the deaths of four of the seven Alphans, since they can be brought back from their Plodex mission at anytime. Unfortunately, Sasquatch, MM and Zuzha's deaths are not so explainable.

Love,
rplass

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Originally Posted by rplass

Over at uncannyxmen.net , the astute reviewer for New Avengers #16 points out:

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This marks the first appearance of Alpha Flight since Alpha Flight (3rd series): The All-New, All-Different Alpha Flight #12. However, that issue left such a mess, and Alpha Flight barely say anything this issue, so it is hard to tell what, if anything, has been cleared up from the third series. At the end of Alpha Flight (3rd series): The All-New, All-Different Alpha Flight #12, we had Guardian, Heather, Snowbird, Shaman, Puck and Earthmover in space. On Earth, there was Sasquatch and his team of Alphans - Nemesis III, Major Mapleleaf II, Puck II, Yukon Jack and Centennial. In addition, the past versions of Guardian, Heather, Snowbird, Shaman, Northstar, Aurora and Puck from circa Alpha Flight (1st series) #12 were brought to the present. The question begs, which Alpha Flight is depicted here? It is hard to tell. Obviously there is only on [sic] Sasquatch, Major Mapleleaf and Puck II. Centennial and Nemesis III are apparently dead, and Yukon Jack and the past Snowbird were married and moved to his kingdom. The team here can possibly be the past Guardian, Heather, Shaman and Puck, which brings up the question of where the past Northstar and Aurora are, and offers up a rather large continuity problem, as the past Heather circa Alpha Flight (1st series) #12 was not a costumed hero. While Heather is a smart woman, the past Heather could have quickly learned how to use a battle suit, but Heather circa Alpha Flight (2nd series) #1, found the geothermal battle suit, which she is wearing here, much more difficult to use then her previous electromagnetic one. If this is the case, it would mean that the real Guardian, Heather, Snowbird, Puck, Shaman and Earthmover are still in space.

It seems odd the Puck (Judd) would as he puts it ‘I’ll do the talking’ considering Guardian, Heather and Sasquatch have all lead Alpha Flight, he has not.

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This hints at what might be the irrelevancy of the deaths of four of the seven Alphans, since they can be brought back from their Plodex mission at anytime. Unfortunately, Sasquatch, MM and Zuzha's deaths are not so explainable.

Love,
rplass

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Hmmmm...Interesting points...I do have to point out though, that if these were indeed members of the Alpha Flight from the past...and they are indeed dead...How will it be possible for the Guardian, Puck, Heather(including baby Hudson) and Shaman in space to continue living? If they were plucked from the past, but die in the present....their present selves will die/fade away too(unless of course, they're temporal copies, instead of the actual AF from the past)....My head hurts now.

Dana

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Originally Posted by Dana

Hmmmm...Interesting points...I do have to point out though, that if these were indeed members of the Alpha Flight from the past...and they are indeed dead...How will it be possible for the Guardian, Puck, Heather(including baby Hudson) and Shaman in space to continue living? If they were plucked from the past, but die in the present....their present selves will die/fade away too(unless of course, they're temporal copies, instead of the actual AF from the past)....My head hurts now.

Dana

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They were plucked from one of the "alternate timelines" created by v.3 alpha's meddling, so it wasn't the past of the alpha we know.

Ben

Would make a great story line though. What if Alpha were dead for good, and it were the real thing circa Vol.1? What would be the ramifications? Alpha Flight did a lot after issue #12. Just think of the villains left unchecked if Alpha isn't there to do their thing. On the other hand it would also ensure they never reared their heads again. Not the finality I'm looking for.

If Alpha Flight died earlier all realities would have been destroyed due to Carcass destroying it.

Is anybody else suspicious that they happened to get rid of the letters page a month before they *********d us over like that?

- Le Messor
"Economy makes men independent."